Questions for Michael Hiltzik on the Senate bill | a Twitter conversation
Questions for Michael Hiltzik on the Senate bill
At peekURL.com/zCch2gt Los Angeles Times business writer Michael Hiltzik promotes the Senate immigration bill, saying among other things this:
"In a sane political atmosphere, passing the Senate immigration bill would be a no-brainer on both sides of the aisle. The Congressional Budget Office says it would increase employment, boost capital investment, raise the relative wages of people now working in the underground economy, improve the productivity of labor and productivity. The bill would reduce the federal deficit, according to the CBO, by about $175 billion through 2023, and by another $700 billion from 2023 through 2033."
Here are some questions based on that paragraph.
"In a sane political atmosphere, passing the Senate immigration bill would be a no-brainer on both sides of the aisle. The Congressional Budget Office says it would increase employment, boost capital investment, raise the relative wages of people now working in the underground economy, improve the productivity of labor and productivity. The bill would reduce the federal deficit, according to the CBO, by about $175 billion through 2023, and by another $700 billion from 2023 through 2033."
Here are some questions based on that paragraph.
This is a Twitter conversation between @24AheadDotCom_ and these users:
hiltzikmPulitzer Prize-winning columnist, author/historian of science, tech, & The New Deal. Read my blog The Economy Hub mhiltzik@latimes.com
kinistDedicated to the advocacy of European-American ethnic interests and the understanding of the principles of Christian Ethnonationalism.
glaivesterA Patriot Fighting to Stop Genocidal #Antijaphetism
#KelliWard #ElectNehlen
#NeverHillary #NeverRyan #NeverRubio
milo9Global Warming Deniers have thwarted every attempt 2 ameliorate effects of Climate Change~Now there are consequences. American blood is on their hands.If any of these users reply, it will be added to the list of tweets below. If you see no replies below, they have not replied.
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: regarding your #immigration editorial, why didn't you mention the *other* things the #CBO said?
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: CBO says Senate bill would lower wages for millions for a decade: http://24ahead.com/n/11910 Why didn't you reveal that?
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: about the "underground economy", since most people know you mean foreign citizens who are here illegally, why the euphemism?
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: shouldn't you - as an American - be more concerned with raising relative wages of your fellow citizens than of foreign citizens?
11 years ago@24AheadDotCom @FalconhunterNRA @hiltzikm Because by controlling language, they control thought.
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: how #immigration "reform" will harm lower-skilled Americans: 24ahead.com/s/immigration-wage-floor Did you know that & not care?
11 years ago.@24AheadDotCom Not really impressed with your math (or reading) skills. Adequate fantasist, though.
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: CBO Dir. Elmendorf: "CBO.. estimates also show that average wages for the entire labor force would be 0.1 percent lower in 2023"
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: CBO Dir. Elmendorf: "...would be 0.1% lower in 2023 and 0.5% higher in 2033 under the legislation than under current law"
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: what part of lower avg wages for a decade - most at low end - isn't clear? Take it up with CBO Dir. Elmendorf if you disagree.
11 years ago.@24AheadDotCom Because influx of lower-wage workers brings the avg down. CBO: doesnt "imply that current US residents would be worse off."
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: pretend you're a cashier at the Cucamonga #Walmart. Will #immigration reform result in *new* competitors for your job?
11 years ago.@24AheadDotCom I'm clear and Elmendorf's clear: But you can't read English.
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: what in Elmendorf's "average wages for the entire labor force would be 0.1 percent lower in 2023" isn't clear??? #immigration
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: regarding "millions of Americans", would you say CBO's wage lowering would only occur among illegal aliens? Because that's nuts.
11 years ago.@24AheadDotCom Try reading it. CBO, p 4 "the addl people who would become residents under the legislation would earn lower wages...(1/2)
11 years ago.@24AheadDotCom (2/2)"..., on average, than other residents, which would pull down the average wage and per capita GNP."
Get it now?
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: Elmendorf punts on who'd be harmed: http://factcheck.org/2013/06/the-facts-on-cbos-immigration-report #immigration #ows #occupy
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: would legalizing illegal aliens increase competition for lower-skilled jobs illegal aliens (kinda) can't do now like WalMart?
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: that is, would legalized former illegal aliens be able to move up in the job market & compete for jobs they couldn't get before?
11 years ago.@24AheadDotCom Thnx for tweeting a study that supports my position. Well played!
11 years agoRT @24AheadDotCom: .@hiltzikm: would legalizing illegal aliens increase competition for lower-skilled jobs illegal aliens (kinda) can't do …
11 years agoRT @24AheadDotCom: .@hiltzikm: that is, would legalized former illegal aliens be able to move up in the job market & compete for jobs they …
11 years ago.@hiltzikm @24AheadDotCom Even if no effect on "current workers'" wages, wouldn't wages of illegal alien "current workers" rise...
11 years ago.@hiltzikm @24AheadDotCom ...implying that American citizens' might fall under "no wage change?"
11 years ago.@milo9 @hiltzikm @24AheadDotCom Don't the CBO numbers assume that enforcement provisions of bill will be honored? Never were in past.
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: your post says nada about lower wages for Americans as implied by CBO study; it's delusional that Americans wouldn't be harmed.
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: 2nd try: would those in #immigration reform be able to move up in the job mkt & compete for jobs they couldn't get before? #ows
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: i.e., illegal alien who could only work in cheap motel as maid will be able to work for #Walmart after getting legalization. #oo
11 years ago.@24AheadDotCom @hiltzikm, you say lower wages due only to new lower-wage workers; current workers' wages unaffected. But...
11 years ago.@hiltzikm: and, won't that increased competition for some jobs lower wages (or drive out of work) Americans in those jobs? #immigration
11 years ago.@24AheadDotCom @hiltzikm ...how many "current workers" are illegal aliens whose wages would likely go up? What wld happen to legal workers?
11 years ago.@hiltzikm @24AheadDotCom I note the factcheck doesn't "debunk" unemployment claims.
11 years ago@Glaivester @hiltzikm @24AheadDotCom Current immigration is near zero. Why? No jobs. Employers must be punished if they employ undocked.
11 years ago@24AheadDotCom I don't understand your point & how immigration & Wall Mart mix. Explain it to me.
11 years agoRT @24AheadDotCom: .@Chris_Moody: can you ask @bterris when he'll issue a correction for http://t.co/0Kntb01Nml ? #immigration #TheAtlantic…
11 years agoRT @24AheadDotCom: .@stevekolowich: Gillibrand's current #immigration stance is very pro-Big Business, pro-Big Bank. Is that what "progress…
11 years agoRT @24AheadDotCom: .@milo9: "current #immigration" is hardly near zero. In addition to ~1 million citizenships, there's http://t.co/kkkfbQ6…
11 years ago.@milo9 @24AheadDotCom Big business wants more unskilled immigrants so there is more competition for jobs. More labor supply = lower wages.
11 years ago.@milo9 @hiltzikm @24AheadDotCom Are you advocating punishing employers or saying that they ARE being punished?
11 years agoRT @24AheadDotCom: .@milo9: why do you think USChamber, WalMart, Tyson Foods, etc. want more #immigration? To increase range of fast food o…
11 years agoRT @24AheadDotCom: #ObamacareGov is *not* a secure site: http://t.co/RdpjmsM8kQ ACA fan or not, I urge anyone not to use it. #ows #tcot #un…
11 years agoRT @24AheadDotCom: .@RaineyReitman: how about you? Do you have a list of 2nd tier politicians that *support* what #StopWatchingUS opposes?
11 years agoRT @24AheadDotCom: Trying to get #StopWatchingUS to use Question Authority is sad & funny for me: http://t.co/uOgBbzjuqt Just hyping it has…
11 years ago.@24AheadDotCom Isn't @/hiltzikm what that little guy had to say to leave our dimension in Superman? #kltpzyxm
11 years ago@24AheadDotCom I don't want new immigration. You penalize employers and illegal immigration should stabilize @ low levels.
11 years ago@24AheadDotCom Don't start that "liberal" shit w/ me. RW Extremists are the biggest obstacle to solving the myriad problems that beset us.
11 years agoRT @24AheadDotCom: Apr 2007: David Redlawsk/Caroline Tolbert offer misleading University of Iowa immigration poll: http://t.co/QBjWpGBAmV #…
11 years ago.@milo9 @hiltzikm @24AheadDotCom Gang of 8 #CIR bill gives amnesty to EMPLOYERS who hired illegal aliens in past.
http://t.co/kamZBbmGSX
11 years ago.@milo9 @hiltzikm @24AheadDotCom Moreover, bill scraps current E-Verify system, promises to replace it - eventually.
11 years ago.@milo9 @24AheadDotCom We all agree that employers should be penalized. But Senate #CIR bill pardons businesses who hired them in past...
11 years ago.@milo9 @24AheadDotCom ...and scraps E-Verify program, promising to replace it, IIRC, FIVE YEARS from now.
11 years ago@milo9 @24AheadDotCom
2012 legal immigration 1,031,631
http://t.co/7lkAv6d58a
2012 net illegal immigration 200,000
http://t.co/3OcduW7ScL
11 years ago.@milo9 @24AheadDotCom To be clear, those are the number of people immigrating for 2012 (i.e. new immigration)
11 years ago@Glaivester @hiltzikm @24AheadDotCom That's no good. But I have to verify that. It sounds like a RW meme.
11 years ago@Glaivester @24AheadDotCom Wiki charts are refer to legal immigrants. Reducing legal immigration is a separate issue.
11 years ago@Glaivester @24AheadDotCom Per Pew, New illegal immigration has risen .2 million since recession is over (?). Figure is within margin error