March 31, 2005
Earlier I noted the DUmmies being somewhat sane on immigration matters. Now comes the thread "How the Working Class Views Immigration". Aside from the bit about "working class" it could be a thread at... FreeRepublic. This similar thread is not quite as good but still of interest. Please, please, please: I assure you. Our operatives are not behind this. #3294 is concentrating on liberal blogs, and #83921 is on vacation. No, this is coming from inside DUmmyland itself.
Posted to Immigration2005a at March 31, 2005 08:54 PM
Comments
A buddy of mine with no college education and no previous experience just got a job as a carpenter's apprentice. He's making $12.50/hour plus health insurance. With the amount of overtime these guys work, we're talking about a lot of money.
Anti-immigrant nut cases have been pissing and moaning for centuries about the adverse effects of first the Irish, then the Chinese and now Mexicans. Their doomsday predictions never come true. As we absorb millions of immigrants every decade, we have one of the lowest unemployment rates in the world and one of the highest standards of living. Yet that doesn't stop the anti-immigration nuts from whining. Geez.
Posted by: Ralph Nelson at April 1, 2005 09:11 AM
That settles it! Ralph Nelson's buddy is doing fine so that means there are no problems inherent in mass immigration. You truly are a brilliant analyst,Ralph.
Posted by: seelow heights at April 1, 2005 09:52 PM
seelow heights wrote: "That settles it! Ralph Nelson's buddy is doing fine so that means there are no problems inherent in mass immigration. You truly are a brilliant analyst,Ralph."
I can't help but sense the sarcasm. If you think we are so bad off, then show where. Please. Enlighten us all. How is our nation suffering so bad? I would like to know.
Posted by: Ralph at April 2, 2005 04:02 AM
In 1950 the US had a poulation of 150 million. Today it has 300 million. It is scheduled to be 404 million by 2050. Two-thirds of population growth comes from immigration. Should we shoot for a billion? http://www.prb.org/Content/NavigationMenu/PT_articles/January-March_2000/Immigration_Comes_Alive_in_Newest_U_S__Population_Projections.htm
Also
http://www.susps.org/overview/immigration.html
Immigrant impact on wages
http://www.vdare.com/rubenstein/american_dropouts.htm
n an earlier column [Immigration Now Impacting College-Educated Employment And Incomes, March 25, 2004] I reported that immigrants are over-represented at both the top and bottom of the educational spectrum, with relatively little in between. Odd result: the impact of immigrant wage competition falls disproportionately on American high school dropouts and college grads respectively.
Northeastern University’s recent study of immigrants in the U.S. labor force, which as I reported last week shows that immigrants are crowding Americans out of the job market, also presents fresh evidence for this immigrant impact on American wages.
Looking at just those immigrant workers that came to the U.S. since 2000, the Northeastern labor economists found:
bullet 35 percent hadn’t graduated high school, versus 11 percent of all U.S.-born workers
bullet 28 percent had a BA or higher degree, slightly above the ratio for U.S.-born workers
Andrew Sum et al., " Foreign Immigration and the Labor Force of the U.S., July 2004"
This probably overstates the educational achievements of immigrants. Many are counted as high school graduates if they completed school in their country of origin—regardless of the local standards. And even college-educated immigrants may be at a disadvantage due to a lack of English proficiency. The Northeastern University study notes that, of the top twenty countries of origin, only two—Canada and England —recognize English as the official language. [Table 1.]
Language proficiency will likely be an increasing problem because Hispanics increasingly dominate the new (i.e., post-2000) group of immigrant workers. According to the Northeastern University study:
bullet 56 percent are Hispanic
bullet 19 percent are Asian
bullet 18 percent are White, non-Hispanic
bullet 5.2 percent are Black, non-Hispanic
Mexico alone accounted for 1,040,000, or 37 percent, of all immigrant workers arriving since 2000. India was a distant second, with 140,000. [Table 1.]
Nearly three-quarters of all immigrant high school dropouts are Hispanics; only 8 percent are Asians. Among college-educated immigrants, the ratios are reversed: 45 percent are Asian, 16 percent are Hispanic. [See National Data of April 7, 2004.] In other words, Hispanic dropouts and Asian college grads increasingly dominate the foreign-born workforce.
What are the implications for native workers?
The rule of thumb is that a 10 percent increase in the labor supply diminishes the wages of native-born workers by 3.5 percent. [See George Borjas, “The Labor Demand Curve Is Downward Sloping" May 2003]
Since 15 percent of the U.S. workforce is currently foreign-born, the average native-born worker today earns about 5.25 percent less due to the immigrant presence.
But this average is a statistical artifact that masks the divergence in immigrant impact on the American-born workforce:
bullet Wages of U.S.-born dropouts are 7.9 percent lower due to immigration.
bullet Wages of high school graduates and workers with some college are 2.3 percent lower due to immigration.
bullet Wages of U.S.-born college grads are 3.9 percent lower due to immigration.
The U.S. has one of the most unequal income distributions in the developed world. We are also massively importing foreign-born workers. These trends are not coincidental.
Edwin S. Rubenstein is President of ESR Research Economic Consultants in Indianapolis.
Posted by: seelow heights at April 2, 2005 05:32 PM
Some more info that relates mainly to high-tech workers. http://www.hireamericancitizens.org/amazing.html
At least 4 million H-1B visas were certified by the INS between 1998-2001.
Many H-1B workers are paid minimum wage as their official salary, and the rest of their salary is paid as "U.S. Living Expenses" that are non-taxable.(2003 Data)
L-1 workers are considered employees of a foreign company and paid by the foreign company. This means that they do not have to pay U.S. taxes. (2003 Data)
Students from India are given an exemption from paying taxes. (IRS Circular E, Employer's Tax Guide, page 14)
At least 800,000 highly-skilled U.S. workers are now unemployed as a direct result of the H-1B visa legislation, which failed to include protection for U.S. workers. (2001 Reporting)
"Siemens management mandated Americans to train their foreign replacement workers; in Lake Mary, FL" After training, the Americans were laid off while the foreigners live and work in Lake Mary, FL (2003)
By the end of January 2003 more than 70% of laid-off technology workers had exhausted (used up) their unemployment benefits. Unemployment for technology workers has continued to rise, giving little hope for re-employment.
The total number of US technical jobs is around 8.5 million and we have imported around 3-4 million temporary foreign technical workers.
In the year 2001, 9 out of every 10 new job openings for computer/IT were taken by H-1Bs, and despite record unemployment the INS issued 312,000 visas in 2002.
Even though they are legally mandated to do so, the Immigration and naturalization Service (INS) has publicly and willfully refused to deport H-1B workers with expired visas. Although the law says that H-1B visa holders must leave the country immediately after being laid-off or fired, the INS has told them that no one will be forced to leave, and to keep looking for new jobs.
The INS estimates that roughly 3.2 million of the estimated eight million illegal immigrants living in the U.S. (or 40 percent), originally entered the country on non-immigrant visas (such as H-1B, L-1, etc.). These 3.2 million non-immigrants have become illegal immigrants by overstaying their visas. Because of its failure to implement an entry-exit system as required by a 1996 law, the INS has no way to identify or locate them. As more H-1Bs and other non-immigrant visa holders lose their jobs in the recession, and remain in the country until they find work, this number will no doubt be significantly higher.
Posted by: seelow heights at April 2, 2005 06:03 PM
Just one more tidbit.
http://www.diversityalliance.org/docs/DASA-FAQs.html
• What is immigration's impact on American workers?
The National Academy of Science reported in 1997 that from 1980 to 1995, 44 percent of the decline in the real wages of high school dropouts resulted from immigration. The study conducted by UC Davis Professor Norman Matloff also concludes that large numbers of older immigrant and U.S-born computer scientists are displaced by newly arrived foreign-born computer programmers.
Posted by: seelow heights at April 2, 2005 06:13 PM
Despite the usual doomsday bs that people have been spewing for centuries, we are hardly adversely affected by immigration. Those with low education levels are falling farther and farther behind the educated all over the world. In fact, the skill premium in Mexico is even greater than in the US. Certainly that's not caused by immigration into Mexico.
The influx of educated immigrants has had a net positive effect on our economy as a whole.
And one thing that anti-immigration spinmeisters never consider is the benefits to the immigrants themselves and their families. This is NEVER taken into consideration by anti-immigration psychos as if the immigrants are not people or even worthy of being considered. When the benefits the immigrants themselves are considered, it is clear that society as a whole reaps a windfall reward from migration.
Posted by: Ralph at April 3, 2005 07:11 AM
Ralph is preaching the standard world-without-borders "libertarian" nitwittery. Notice that he thinks both that the US-born poor deserve to starve and that an open borders immigration policy can be construed as a species of foreign aid. What the libertarians want would bring about a borderless world run by the major corporations.Goodbye all workplace protection and farewell nature! There is a reason why the libertarian loonies have been running candidates for some thirty years and have yet to be elected to anything.
Posted by: seelow heights at April 3, 2005 06:21 PM
And seelow heights has resorted to the typical tactic: when you can't address the issues that your opponent raises, put words in his mouth.
I have been accused of preaching world-without-borders nitwitter. I never preached such a thing. I have been accused of thinking that US-born poor deserve to starve to death. I have never thought anything like that.
seelow heights is pitiful.
Posted by: Ralph at April 4, 2005 12:08 PM
