Will the Bush administration reporting on Minuteman Project lead to impeachment?

One can only hope. While treason is narrowly defined, if the Bush administration has indeed been giving the Mexican government information on law-abiding U.S. groups operating inside the U.S. that doesn't relate to specific Mexican nationals, they have committed treason in the general if not the Constitutional sense. We should give the Mexican government information on their nationals who have been detained or who have had encounters with border watch groups. However, providing that government with the locations of those groups - or even with opposition research - is crossing the line into colluding with a foreign government.

And, of course, the Democrats won't be able to add 2+2 in this case, just as they can't do the math in all similar cases. Their complaints about corruption fall on deaf ears because they support corruption when it involves illegal immigration; they complain about domestic spying but will refuse to discuss this case. If they had opposed illegal immigration in 2004 Kerry would have been elected president. And, if they came out strongly against illegal immigration in general and the current case in particular, they could pick up millions of new votes. The problem, of course, is that the Democratic leadership is about as American as the GOP leadership. It is truly tragic that the U.S. cannot have at least one political party that represents U.S. interests rather than selling them out.

The original report on the collaboration is in Mexico kept in loop: Border Patrol giving Minuteman locations.

The MMP responds here and here, promising even more information to come.

The BP responds in "Inland Valley Daily Bulletin Inaccurate" ( cbp.gov/xp/cgov/newsroom/highlights/news_highlights/statement05092006.xml ). However, their denials are to a great extent contradicted by statements in the SBSun article:
A U.S. Customs and Border Protection spokesman confirmed the notification process, describing it as a standard procedure meant to reassure the Mexican government that immigrants' rights are being observed.

"It's not a secret where the Minuteman volunteers are going to be," Mario Martinez said Monday.
Rep. Tom Tancredo responds here:
"The Minutemen haven't been accused of breaking the law. Quite the contrary - they have gone out of their way to aid law enforcement and ensure the safety of our border. The U.S. government has no grounds upon which to stifle the Minutemen's constitutional right to organize," Tancredo concluded. "I want to know the legal basis for CBP informing a foreign government of the activities of private citizens who are obeying the law."
The AP offers a roundup in "U.S. notifying Mexico of some civilian border patrol acts".

Some of the following may be the pages from which the SBSun report was derived:


There are thousands more mentioning the MMP, so feel free to start searching.

The first of those above mentions Griffen and also implies that Mexico was successful in shutting down Bonner's civilian border patrol proposal:
Como respuesta, la tarde del propio 21 de julio el Departamento de Seguridad Interna de Estados Unidos expreso, a traves de un comunicado de prensa, que las declaraciones del Comisionado Bonner no representaban una posicion oficial.
And, on a somewhat related note, see this report from the CHCRL: portal.sre.gob.mx/ime/pdf/IV.8_Anexo.pdf It proposes ways that the Mexican government can oppose the MMP and similar groups, including spreading opposition research to domestic groups.

UPDATE: More impeachment talk. More on the situation here.

There's audio of Chris Simcox discussing the situation here. The MMP links to the sre.gob.mx/eventos/minuteman/reporte3.htm above, saying:
Widespread reports yesterday of the U.S. Border Patrol reporting locations of Minuteman activities along the border have now broadened in scope. The reports obtained from the Mexican government include an August 2005 document, "Third Report on the Activities of Vigilantes" -- posted on Mexico's Secretary of Foreign Relations Web site -- suggest U.S. officials were giving out more details than required by the Vienna Convention. Part of that information included reports on activities in the interior United States in locations such as Illinois, Nevada, Utah, Massachusetts and Tennessee.
UPDATE 2: Here's Part 2.


"..., and apparently things haven't changed."

In what way? What exactly is your point, anyway?
That the people who fought for the independence of Texas from Mexico were "TOTAL ASSHOLES"? And that Texans today who think mass illegal immigration from a third world country like Mexico (which is not at all an unfair description of what is going on) is a bad idea and so decide to join the Minuteman project in order to try to do something about it are a "TOTAL ASSHOLES"?

That's as close as I can guess.

If so, I'll save myself another posting: You're entitled to your opinion about who is a 'TOTAL ASSHOLE' and who isn't, but like the other guy you're a TOTAL MORON for thinking it's some kind of point worth making in this context.

Although "eh" is right that the circumstances of the Texas War for Independence is completely irrelevant to the contemporary situation, it is important to note that slavery issue was not what provoked the rebellion. http://www.digitalhistory.uh.edu/database/article_display.cfm?HHID=312
But in 1832, General Antonio Lopez de Santa Anna, a Mexican politician and soldier, became Mexico's president. Colonists hoped that he would make Texas a self-governing state within the Mexican republic. But once in power, Santa Anna proved to be less liberal than many Texans had believed. In 1834, he overthrew Mexico's constitutional government, abolished state governments, and made himself dictator. When Stephen Austin went to Mexico City to try to settle the Texans' grievances, Santa Anna imprisoned him in a Mexican jail for a year.

On November 3, 1835, American colonists adopted a constitution and organized a temporary government, but voted overwhelmingly against declaring independence. A majority of colonists hoped to attract the support of Mexican liberals in a joint effort to depose Santa Anna and to restore power to the state governments, hopefully including a separate state of Texas.
In the middle of 1835, scattered local outbursts erupted against Mexican rule. Then, a band of 300-500 Texas riflemen - who comprised the entire Texas army - captured Mexico's military headquarters in San Antonio. Revolution was underway
The selective morality of left-wing kooks is odd- they always condemn race-based chattell slavery in the ante-bellum US, but say little about slavery that persists in Africa today and usually praise someone like Fidel Castro,who holds the entire population of Cuba in slavery. THe fact that some Cubans seem happy with the staus quo is no more meaningful than the fact that some slaves were happy living on the plantation in the Old South.

"So fuckin what... Now maybe you can explain what any of that has to do with today."

What it has to do with today is that the denizens of Texas have a long history as TOTAL ASSHOLES, and apparently things haven't changed.

"latter day"

Former-day is the right term here.

Yeah, hey, thanks for the history lesson.

"So fuckin what..."

Now maybe you can explain what any of that has to do with today. See, we're now in the era (and have been for some time, in case you haven't noticed) of modern nation states, having fixed borders and immigration laws to (ostensibly) control the flow of people across those borders. All of that serves many purposes, one of which is to prevent an influx of people whose national allegiance is, ahem, questionable. As latter day Mexico found out.

"So fuckin what, ya traitorous cocksucker!"

Jesus, what a great comeback - you are one clever dude.

Hey, bobdevo! So fuckin what, ya traitorous cocksucker!

History quiz for Texan Minutemen:

Q. Why did the Texians break away from Mexico?

A. (1) Mexico was attempting to close the border to prevent waves of illegal aliens coming from the US into Mexico; and (2) Slavery was illegal in Mexico.

Those brave boys at the Alamo died for the sacred right to own slaves. Yee-hah, dawgs, remember the 'mo!!!

cheers to eh.

"I know a few from Texas, yes. They are proud to be drunken racist assholes."

I know a "few" Mexicans, so guess if I was to go from there and say that all of them were either criminals or future high school dropouts, that would be A-OK with you then, right...dude? If so, then I guess the Minutemen are doing a good thing by trying to keep them out, wouldn't you say?

You really are a dumbass.

"I want to know the legal basis for CBP informing a foreign government of the activities of private citizens who are obeying the law."

I'd like to know the legal basis under which the CBP *wouldn't* inform a foreign government of the activities of private citizens who are obeying the law.

Cause if there ain't a law against it...

Republican politicians from Bush on down are turning their backs on their base.

The reason in my opinion is one.... DEMOGRAPHICS.

No political party can afford to loose California, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas for generations to come. All of these states are at,or about to become in the next decade a majority base Hispanic region of our Country.

This fact is what has Republicans in a bind. Democrats don't mind beeing identified as pasive or active supporters of illegal immigration, but for Republicans this is becoming a major headache.

I would compare this situation as the turning point in the 60's when Democrats decided to go against segregation and they lost the South.

The Democrats back then stood up for their principles. If they lost the South as a result in return they gained a conscience, and the ethernal gratitude of black people.

Is the Republicans turn now to stand for their principles.

I think the drug of choice for calming down republicans waking to reality in Bushworld is Klonopin:

This is not a partisan issue at all: it's the government versus the people. Wake up retards, left and right.

Also, I'm voting Democrat this Fall. I don't want a minor defeat. I want an absolute disaster for the Republicans. I would rather suffer two years of Democratic betrayal in the hope of cleaning of the Republican party than participate in the current charade.

Dems want human rights for immigrants and job protection for American workers.

Go on drinking the cool-aid, John. The Democrats want a new voting block.

First of all, they aren't immigrants. They are illegal aliens. Immigrants come legally. I can't walk into your house uninvited and they can't come into the country illegally. Simply put, they are criminals. Don't debase the language with Orwellian descriptions.

Second, how are you helping working Americans by allowing a flood of cheap labor to undercut their wages?

Third, are we treating the illegal aliens badly? Are we shooting them at the border or in the streets? Do we deny them medical care and due process? The answer is no. However, that doesn't mean we don't have a right to deport them.

"It's so sad that people who really believe in the U.S. as a country, a people, and a culture have no place to turn."

Exactly. Commies or Facsists? I'll be voting Dems this fall, not because I believe in their talking points. But because this horrendous administration needs to be checked. And the red sycophantic sheep in Congress won't. It is sad that another significant party that represents people and not corporations hasn't emerged.

"I'm sure you can say that because you know "most" of them personally, right dude?"
Posted by: eh at May 10, 2006 08:59 AM

I know a few from Texas, yes. They are proud to be drunken racist assholes. Get a few Lonestars in them and they will tell you all about it. I haven't met any of the ones from Arizona who were photographed waving a Nazi flag.

mexico city is buying the IOB'S WITH RED CHINA MONEY. Long live the USA WE WILL ALL BE FIGHTING SOON.( :-)
Posted by: Fred Dawes at May 10, 2006 09:53 AM

What is an IOB? You know that most of our military is purchased with money borrowed from red China, right? You might want to concentrate on fighting your mental illness, Fred. Prozac. Seriously.

LomaAlta with the people on this site most want the death of the USA, LIKE John Gillnitz who is the real racists for his people, and yes bush is a one world guy and i think he made Bin Laden and is doing his best to kill us all, down with mexico and its evil system and people, see world war two, mexico loved hitler, end of story, death to the emeies of freedom. Fox is the new world Hitler. soon the war will start, read about Iran and the IOB'S Coming out soon, you will understand why mexico city is buying the IOB'S WITH RED CHINA MONEY. Long live the USA WE WILL ALL BE FIGHTING SOON.( :-)

I see the democrats and Kerrys name come up again...

Yeah, in the sense that if they had sense to propose controlling the border and a reasonable immigration system, they would crush the Republicans. Instead, they are looking for a whole new victim class and voting block.

It's so sad that people who really believe in the U.S. as a country, a people, and a culture have no place to turn.

I fear for the saety of the patriotic and nonviolent Minutemen. This smells like a setup where the minutemen are attacked and the deaths and injuries are then blamed on the Minutemen to justify crushing them.

"Most of the MMP are a bunch a drunken racist assholes."

I'm sure you can say that because you know "most" of them personally, right dude?

While I certainly don't know "most" of them, nonetheless I think I can guarantee that as a group they are, on average, a lot less criminal and a lot less "drunken" than the people whose (illegal) entry they are trying to prevent.

And maybe it's just me, but I would say that makes the illegals the "assholes" here.

Just like your comment makes you one.


We liberals have been saying that the Bush administration represents a few powerful interests and not the American people, who they dupe wirh Rovian propaganda, all along.

It's amusing to us to see right finally get it on at least one issue, immigration where corporations want the cheap labor and the administration delivers, even if the right sadly still can't see the policy for what it is, and instead goes on about paranoid treason charges.

But hey, as long as they oppose Bush, that's the main thing good for the nation.

Sadly, they typically fail to act on their opinion and actually stop voting for his party.

Indeed, treason is narrowly defined. Article III, Section III of the U.S. Constitution defines it thus:

"Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court."

You self-identified lone-wackos have been prepared to allow Bush to illegally wiretap your phones, to invade foreign countries based on intentionally misleading intelligence, to indicate refusal to faithfully execute hundreds of laws passed by Congress, to out CIA agents working on matters of Iranian nucelar capabilities, to appoint a hooker-chasing hack Congressman to head the CIA, to allow US citizens to rot and die in New Orleans, to pour one trillion dollars (that's $1,000,000,000,000.00) down a rathole in the desert, to raise the debt limit to TEN TRILLION DOLLARS - but now he's gone too far and you've got your panties all in a bunch about cooperating with the Mexican government to inhibit dangerous vigilante actions along our southern border?

And now you want to whine: "Bush is a bad man - wahhhhh!" Well, duh!

Most of the MMP are a bunch a drunken racist assholes. They are a detriment to border security, not a benefit. Dems want human rights for immigrants and job protection for American workers. Repubs want a subservient underclass to enrich corporate profits.

I see the democrats and Kerrys name come up again. Yep, even though the republicult party controls all aspects of the government, be sure to accuse the democrats of being just as much at fault. Do you feel that this makes you look less like an ass?

this mexican story tells it all, read it, this is a total outrage, is our government also telling were our troops are in iraq? if so that would be a real attack on us as a nation and the people, why who is doing who in this fight for our rights? see the date 2005, by the way i did not edit

To return

Mexico D.F. 11 of April of 2005.


First report of activities on the call Minuteman Project

The Government of Mexico condemns the vigilantismo activities that citizens of the United States make in the border. Although it is sovereign faculty of any State to take the measures necessary to assure the protection his borders and the fulfillment of their dispositions in migratory matter, these activities correspond only and exclusively to the competent authorities of the States.

Ever since knowledge was had of which a group of civilians tried to organize itself to make monitoring workings in the border with the objective to avoid the crossing of undocumented immigrants, the Government of Mexico expressed publicly his sentence and initiated diverse actions with authorities from the United States to effect of:

No, becuase both parties want the same thing, the USA Dead. reconquista and bin laden are only tools to that end.